Is it really that hard to create a 1:1 translation without deciding to change what the character actually said?

It's tricky. Languages often do not have equivalents to the letter, and then there's a problem with cultural acceptance and all that.

I personally believe that games and movies should always be experienced in their native language whenever possible, unfortunately, I do not speak Japanese, so I had to make do with the English subtitling. Still a fantastic experience, imho, though.

Well, yes actually. Believe it or not, a 1:1 translation would be near-incomprehensible to an English-speaking audience: https://www.ulatus.com/translation-blog/top-challenges-in-japanese-translation/

Originally posted by Aerodynamic41:

Well, yes actually. Believe it or not, a 1:1 translation would be near-incomprehensible to an English-speaking audience: https://www.ulatus.com/translation-blog/top-challenges-in-japanese-translation/

Subject Adjective Verb isn't incomprehensible, nor is "Kai" instead of "Others" or leaving the honorifics in. Quite frankly, I think the obsession with purging all Japanese words from English translations to be absurd. Yes, there are words that have no English equivalent but I've seen translations of gouchisousama deshita as bon appétit, exchanging one foreign word for another.

I understand small amounts of Japanese, so it's quite noticeable how Kasanecha or Onecha gets straight out dropped in favor of terse English. Honestly, I'd prefer 1:1 translations since that makes it even easier to pick up on the language.

Everyone Engish perfect need speak?

Originally posted by Mouse:

Originally posted by Aerodynamic41:

Well, yes actually. Believe it or not, a 1:1 translation would be near-incomprehensible to an English-speaking audience: https://www.ulatus.com/translation-blog/top-challenges-in-japanese-translation/

Subject Adjective Verb isn't incomprehensible, nor is "Kai" instead of "Others" or leaving the honorifics in. Quite frankly, I think the obsession with purging all Japanese words from English translations to be absurd. Yes, there are words that have no English equivalent but I've seen translations of gouchisousama deshita as bon appétit, exchanging one foreign word for another.

I understand small amounts of Japanese, so it's quite noticeable how Kasanecha or Onecha gets straight out dropped in favour of terse English. Honestly, I'd prefer 1:1 translations since that makes it even easier to pick up on the language.

Everyone Engish perfect need speak?

the reason why you would translate gouchisousama deshita as bon appétit is because most English speakers know the meaning/purpose of bon appétit. I have/had no idea what gouchisousama deshita means according to google translate its "It was home" in the context of food that would be absolute nonsense. I speak both German, English bit Spanish and a few words Japanese and you simply can't do straight translations it sounds horrible. context is very important.
and personally whenever I hear people use things like chan chin kun and what have not in English its sounds cringe like hell.
leaving that stuff in just sounds unprofessional. it would be if I started to add all the German words English has no equivalent for to this text.

Originally posted by Mouse:

Is it really that hard to create a 1:1 translation without deciding to change what the character actually said?

Depends on the genre. For example the Bud Spencer and Terence Hill movies were "serious" in native and most translations but in germany they were translated in a comedy way with many extra sentences put in which became legendary around here.

For Scarlet Nexus i don't care so much because the story is 0815 anime trope and you can already guess what they say the moment a scene starts. In this case a comedy translation would even keep it interesting. ;)

Originally posted by Zaris:

Originally posted by Mouse:

Is it really that hard to create a 1:1 translation without deciding to change what the character actually said?

Depends on the genre. For example the Bud Spencer and Terence Hill movies were "serious" in native and most translations but in Germany they were translated in a comedy way with many extra sentences put in which became legendary around here.

For Scarlet Nexus I don't care so much because the story is 0815 anime trope and you can already guess what they say the moment a scene starts. In this case a comedy translation would even keep it interesting. ;)

wait those weren't comedies outside Germany WTF. my childhood was a lie.

Because Japanese is a garbage language only fit to be spoken by disgusting neckbeard tentacle fetishists.
Jokes aside, it's because a 1:1 translation ends up sounding ridiculous.
Go watch *any* Sentai Filmworks dub and you'll pick up on the problem immediately.

1:1 "works" if you replace the words used which fundamentally means the same. Just because the audience might be uncultured doesn't mean you have to change things up for the worse. In fact, it would only do em good because they would figure out things for themselves unless they're brainlets which in that case they remain the same.

And this goes for any translated language medium.

Originally posted by Bork Bork:

1:1 "works" if you replace the words used which fundamentally means the same. Just because the audience might be uncultured doesn't mean you have to change things up for the worse. In fact, it would only do em good because they would figure out things for themselves unless they're brainlets which in that case they remain the same.

And this goes for any translated language medium.

It really doesn't though.
Fundamental differences in sentence structuring and grammatical syntax mean that a direct 1:1 translation comes across as word salad.
It's not a matter of the audience being uncultured, it's a matter of people wanting dialogue to sound like something a human being with a functioning brain would actually say, rather than being little more than a Google translate result.
A good dub has to strike a balance between remaining faithful to the intent of the original work while being understandable in the language it is being converted into, and personally I think Scarlet Nexus does a decent job of that.
Is it perfect?
Nah.
But it's a whole hell of a lot better than a lot of the trash dubs I've seen over the years.

Originally posted by Kerrack:

Originally posted by Bork Bork:

1:1 "works" if you replace the words used which fundamentally means the same. Just because the audience might be uncultured doesn't mean you have to change things up for the worse. In fact, it would only do em good because they would figure out things for themselves unless they're brainlets which in that case they remain the same.

And this goes for any translated language medium.

It really doesn't though.
Fundamental differences in sentence structuring and grammatical syntax mean that a direct 1:1 translation comes across as word salad.
It's not a matter of the audience being uncultured, it's a matter of people wanting dialogue to sound like something a human being with a functioning brain would actually say, rather than being little more than a Google translate result.
A good dub has to strike a balance between remaining faithful to the intent of the original work while being understandable in the language it is being converted into, and personally I think Scarlet Nexus does a decent job of that.
Is it perfect?
Nah.
But it's a whole hell of a lot better than a lot of the trash dubs I've seen over the years.

Dubs are just bad, everyone who plays this game can read, or do "uncultured" people opt out of foreign movies unless it's hard-dubbed? What happens if there is more than one language involved ? Does it get left out, cut or otherwise yeeted? A good example is Black Lagoon which makes no sense as a dubbed medium but somehow it is if you only watched it (or anything else for that matter) dubbed in the first place. It's no different from other any other hard-dubbed/translated media in other countries. You might as well opt out the actual plot and replace it with a trip to to whateverland.

Look at the garbage English translation that is FFXIV. No one speaks (nor ever spoke) like that yet it's a thing because the one responsible for the English script is a dud. Everything is supposed to be period correct yet the only thing period correct about it is absolutely nothing.

Originally posted by Bork Bork:

Originally posted by Kerrack:

It really doesn't though.
Fundamental differences in sentence structuring and grammatical syntax mean that a direct 1:1 translation comes across as word salad.
It's not a matter of the audience being uncultured, it's a matter of people wanting dialogue to sound like something a human being with a functioning brain would actually say, rather than being little more than a Google translate result.
A good dub has to strike a balance between remaining faithful to the intent of the original work while being understandable in the language it is being converted into, and personally I think Scarlet Nexus does a decent job of that.
Is it perfect?
Nah.
But it's a whole hell of a lot better than a lot of the trash dubs I've seen over the years.

Dubs are just bad, everyone who plays this game can read, or do "uncultured" people opt out of foreign movies unless it's hard-dubbed? What happens if there is more than one language involved ? Does it get left out, cut or otherwise yeeted? A good example is Black Lagoon which makes no sense as a dubbed medium but somehow it is if you only watched it (or anything else for that matter) dubbed in the first place. It's no different from other any other hard-dubbed/translated media in other countries. You might as well opt out the actual plot and replace it with a trip to to whateverland.

Look at the garbage English translation that is FFXIV. No one speaks (nor ever spoke) like that yet it's a thing because the one responsible for the English script is a dud. Everything is supposed to be period correct yet the only thing period correct about it is absolutely nothing.

I could make exactly the same argument about *every* Japanese dub.
I have lost count of the ostensibly native-English-speaking characters in Japanese anime who can barely speak Engurishu at all.
But of course they get a free pass because weeaboos have no ability to understand what the word hypocrisy means.
And while we're on the subject; what about dubs that take place outside of Japan?
For instance, why would I watch Baccano in Japanese when it takes place in Brooklyn?
Or as you mentioned, Black Lagoon?
Fully half the cast of which either grew up in or spent most of their adult lives in primarily English-speaking places.
An English dub of it makes perfect sense.
You're just being a derp because you think hating dubs makes you better than people who like them.
About which you are quite wrong.
It just makes you a gross hipster neckbeard.

Because americans think they are the greatest in everything, they believe they are superior writers, superior actors, have superior morals and superior humor. as wy nowadays I prefer german translations, if they are based on the japanese script they tend to be more accurate than american translations.

Originally posted by Aerodynamic41:

Well, yes actually. Believe it or not, a 1:1 translation would be near-incomprehensible to an English-speaking audience: https://www.ulatus.com/translation-blog/top-challenges-in-japanese-translation/

This is such a good article, thanks for this. It's just as i've said in the end.

The translated script for this game seems to be more than enjoyable to me, so much that I still play with the Japanese VA. It feels more original to me. But it's subjective, eh, like everything that comes down to taste.

SN is such an amazing game, I can't waaaait to see where the devs will go next. I really hope there's more in this universe to come, Scarlet Nexus 2 could very well tell Kasane's adventures on the moon, for example.

Originally posted by Kerrack:

Originally posted by Bork Bork:

Dubs are just bad, everyone who plays this game can read, or do "uncultured" people opt out of foreign movies unless it's hard-dubbed? What happens if there is more than one language involved ? Does it get left out, cut or otherwise yeeted? A good example is Black Lagoon which makes no sense as a dubbed medium but somehow it is if you only watched it (or anything else for that matter) dubbed in the first place. It's no different from other any other hard-dubbed/translated media in other countries. You might as well opt out the actual plot and replace it with a trip to to whateverland.

Look at the garbage English translation that is FFXIV. No one speaks (nor ever spoke) like that yet it's a thing because the one responsible for the English script is a dud. Everything is supposed to be period correct yet the only thing period correct about it is absolutely nothing.

I could make exactly the same argument about *every* Japanese dub.
I have lost count of the ostensibly native-English-speaking characters in Japanese anime who can barely speak Engurishu at all.
But of course they get a free pass because weeaboos have no ability to understand what the word hypocrisy means.
And while we're on the subject; what about dubs that take place outside of Japan?
For instance, why would I watch Baccano in Japanese when it takes place in Brooklyn?
Or as you mentioned, Black Lagoon?
Fully half the cast of which either grew up in or spent most of their adult lives in primarily English-speaking places.
An English dub of it makes perfect sense.
You're just being a derp because you think hating dubs makes you better than people who like them.
About which you are quite wrong.
It just makes you a gross hipster neckbeard.

you might as well give up there is not talking to sub elitists. they are on the same level as flat earthers.

Originally posted by ADMNtek:

Originally posted by Kerrack:

I could make exactly the same argument about *every* Japanese dub.
I have lost count of the ostensibly native-English-speaking characters in Japanese anime who can barely speak Engurishu at all.
But of course they get a free pass because weeaboos have no ability to understand what the word hypocrisy means.
And while we're on the subject; what about dubs that take place outside of Japan?
For instance, why would I watch Baccano in Japanese when it takes place in Brooklyn?
Or as you mentioned, Black Lagoon?
Fully half the cast of which either grew up in or spent most of their adult lives in primarily English-speaking places.
An English dub of it makes perfect sense.
You're just being a derp because you think hating dubs makes you better than people who like them.
About which you are quite wrong.
It just makes you a gross hipster neckbeard.

you might as well give up there is not talking to sub elitists. they are on the same level as flat earthers.

Oh, I'm fully aware that I'm not going to change anyone's mind.
But I'll still go out of my way to point out their hypocrisy and total lack of self-awareness.